Terminators

[El Capitan]

Now, i really do hate terminators. I know I use to use them, and a Bloodthirster and a Chaos Lord but along with OGC rules and improving my own tactical ability ive managed to do away with them as a way of winnign a game (though sometimes they just have to roll out). Anyway has anyone got sme of the new terminator models? I was wondering if they are larger enough to actually make getting into cover more difficult, as this would give them some form of disadvantage over their brethren. Of course this alreadsy counts for their equivalents - Ork Mega Armour, Tyranid Warriors, Wraiths, etc - tho not eldar there far too pansy to be big! - or weak as the game mechanic is

Anywya let me know, cos these irritable behemoths must suffer in small games! In bigger ones ie 3k + they'll still rip thigns up but the amount of damage they do oin the small scale is terror

[LukeG]

We could always give +1 to hit them at short ranges, something that could always be applied to the terror that is dreadnoughts too. Instead of large target add another definition, 'prominant target' or something like that, representing "holy shit they're comiiiiiiing!" and allowing you to pick out the Terminators if they're trying to use a disposable combat squad as a screen.

[Simon]

They are bigger than the last bunch of terminators... So they will suffer a little, I don't think there's any need to throw in that extra rule really, genestealers kill them easily enough...

[El Capitan]

thats okay for you but im getting sick of the heavy cover mega saves of doom. You only get one shot too, by the time you move your heavy weapons in you have an assault cannon on your head.
in 2k point games they are far too dominating

[Charly]

plus 1 to hit at short range seems ok to me, a terminator would be a bit easier to shoot than a normal marine, especially at close range. same goes for dreadnoughts, but if we start bringing that rule in then there are a lot of models which would get the +1 to hit rule, carnifex...hive tyrant... yeah sounds good to me!

[bot]

2ed point of view. termis are too expensive and teleportation is never used just because it's too expensive for it's unreliabilty.
i allow terminators to teleport for no extra points. i just finshed to cast 5 (silicone) close combat termis with one heavy flamer. i'll give them a try as soon as i paint them.

[Charly]

having terminators teleporting into the enemy deployment zome for free would make terminators far too powerfull, they are already very hard to get rid of. have we changed the rule for teleporting in to be less unrealiable?

[LukeG]

Always. Roll a d6 for each Terminator, a 1=all expensises paid trip to the Warp for an eternity of torment.

[bot]

teleporting terminators straight into deployment zone can be quite risky (depending on how large your deployment is) 2d10 deviation means that you can land off table. average deviation is 10".

taking down terminators is hard? hmm. i don't think so. i mean i seldom fight imperial termis (actually i can't remember when was the last time i did that) but i've killed hundreds of chaos marines in my gaming career.

[Charly]

imperial ones have targeters so are more effective than chaos terms, plus they arguably have better weaponry. and 3+ save on 2D6 = hard to get rid of.

[bot]

quote: 3+ save on 2D6 = hard to get rid of

hard to get rid of... check the 2ed wargear book, mate... -4, -6 save availale to almost everyone(see ya)

[LukeG]

You'd be suprised how often they beat that (you'd also be suprised how often Gretchin kill terminators too )

[Charly]

the point being, a terminator squad is harder to get rid of than most things of similar points, obviously if u fire lascannons at them chances are they will suffer. so back to the original question, should they be counted as +1 at short range..

[bot]

quote: you'd also be suprised how often Gretchin kill terminators too
heheh saw that once...

quote: so back to the original question, should they be counted as +1 at short range

40k is mostly short range...
in my opinion: not. beeing unale to hide and 400 points for 5 man squad penalizes them way too much. but maybe you changed the rules too much in favour of termis, i dunno... haven't read your mods yet.

teleportation is what i'd like to see much often but 50% points rise simply voids that option. that's why i'd allow them to teleport for free. 400+pts for 5 men, i mean - jeez...

if you give +1 to termis then +2 to landrider. hmm. i like to see models missing their targets sometimes, you know.

[Charly]

yeah thats the problem as my earlier sarcastic comment outlined. mebbe we should forget the +1 to hit, hopefully the actual physical size of the model will suffice as a down side to using terms - being able to be shot over normal marines, being difficult to hide etc.

[James 40K Champ ***]

yeah I agree with charlymon, the size is enough for me, people do have the weaponry to deal with them, its just bringing it to bare, but if you can shoot over squads thats enough for me.

Or i could carry on doing what I always do.. fly a squad of destroyers upto point blank range so my gause cannon is tickling their nose, then let rip

[Simon]

I quite like the idea of using skirmish screens to protect valuable units. You have to remember that terminators are only coming out as a 5 man squad in most cases. It might be a bit more difficult to get them with ranged weapons, but try close combat and you can take them out of a game. It's not that difficult to get some assault marines with something like powerfists into combat with them... Especially if they hide behind another unit so they don't get shot to shit... No rules mods are needed for them...

[tturen]

I agree no mods are needed. In fact I find terminators a tad weak myself not to mention slowwwww for an expensive unit. Wolf Guard Termi's though, well those guys are well worth the points but incredibly expensive points wise.

[James 40K Champ ***]

damn 3+ on 2 dice!!! damn it to hell!!

[Adoni-Zedek]

I agree with Tturen, terminators are actually kind of weak. Maybe not for the points, but for the fluff. I've given terminators 2 attacks and wounds, and 5's for S & T. They cost 75 points base, though, or 89 with the stormbolter/powerfist combo. (i know, everyone's thinking )

This gives them better staying power, and makes them better in close combat, but it also means I only ever bring them in in 2000 pt battles or higher, and even then only some of the time. But it fits with my idea of their being elite units, and also their rarity. 500 points for a squad with an assault cannon. This (combined with my 25% discount for basic troops) makes them considerably more expensive, and my opponents have no problem with them.

They are still very slow, and the only way to speed them up is a 220 pt LandRaider. Which puts the total cost at around 700-750 points. (I could get 33 basic marines for 750 pts)

Lately I've been equipping them with thunderhammers and storm shields, and running them up the middle. Works just about like a bulldozer. Anything in their path tends to scatter.

Of course, the problem with such a unit is it can't afford to take casualties. Even one member down greatly lessens their effectiveness. And at such a price tag, they only see action in about a quarter of my 2000+pt games

I agree with Bots on the teleporting issue. It's too expensive, so I never do it. Only my Chaos player ever teleports, and only because Abbadon gets it for free, along with his bodyguard. (Lucky for me he tends to teleport too early, trying to take on half my army at once) So if I know Abbadon's coming, I always take a Teleport Jammer (makes him scatter twice, instead of only once)